Quite honestly, we don't really have a lot to say about this image. Since it came to us over the CrackBerry Twitter account and it was so beautiful we thought it fitting enough to go ahead and toss it up for everyone to enjoy. What you see above is both a BlackBerry Bold 9900 and what is presumed to be a BlackBerry Torch 9860, in other words the GSM variation of the Torch 9850 that's set to head to Sprint. Both are shown running on Telus but sadly that's where the joy ends. Still no official device dates for either device as of yet, in fact the 9850/60 still remains unannounced unless you consider the release of the device simulator an official announcement.
Source: @eatcalifornia
Reader comments
BlackBerry Bold 9900 and BlackBerry Torch 9860 spotted on the streets of Toronto
i love the big screen but look at the buttons? seriously? Someone should really get fired for getting out button design like that!
I hope it's not the same design team that designed the new bold tho...why can't they make all the phone design at least as nice as the bold 9900???!
I cant wait to get me a 9900! I hope it doesn't say BlackBerry on both the top and bottom of the phone though.
That torch screen looks not wide enough at all, plus what good is this full touchscreen blackberry for when it doesnt have all the bells and whistles of what most full touch screen phones do now, like face chat, netflix, hulu, good games, none of that is on blackberries unfortunately :( , sad cause I love my white bold 9700 and the new bold coming out, But man I want those things on a blackberry.
The link at the top points to the Touch 9830 NOT a TORCH... come awn!
Shut up and read....
Or a little closer to home, check out many of the bars in Waterloo. There are some in the plaza right beside RIM campus that have many RIM employees visiting frequently.
I've been seeing new devices much more frequently these days and very much in the open.
RIM used to have a very strict policy that if you showed off an unreleased device and you were seen doing so, you'd be fired.
Most RIM employees will even let you have a peek at their device if you're friendly enough ;)
I agree that call it Torch too is a little confusing. The buttons are atrocious. Circa 1974 (obviously not on a cell phone lol).
I have a Storm 2 and it looks better than what is posted above - awful. Bold is looking nice as always though.
Why do they keep calling it a Torch? I though it was called the Touch?
top part of torch/monaco etc looks like 21st century and the 4 buttons makes it 19th century like......cmon RIM be at par with atleast the expectations of your loyal customers.Give them something to be proud of......
I absolutely love BB, but it's obvious that while I hate to admit it, I'm clearly not the only one that has decided to leave bb until they "catch up" with ANDROID, but even these 2 devices appear to still be behind. I hope this isn't considered to be bashing RIM, but it truly disappoints, hell it almost hurts me that they are failing to keep up, especially in the cosmetic dept. I'll go back to bb,, I have no doubt, but for now ANDROID appears to be winning over alot more bb faithfuls than I thought..
Thats NOT a TORCH!
Release them!!!!!!
A note to the carriers and RIM: CMON ON ALREADY! Ok. I feel much better now.
After having spent some time with both of these devices neither one of the phones feel or look cheap. The are both rock solid devices and the all touch device was super smooth and very quick as far as software goes. And I know leaked docs has given the all touch the name torch and volt but i can assure you the phone will not be called either one of those names. Matter of fact RIM has yet to give this phone a name.
That's something I was happy to read.
As much as I can't wait to replace my Storm with either the torch or the touch it seems like with all this talk of qnx next year its like these phones are just a stop gap in between and by this tome next year will be obsolete once the qnx operating system shows up.
Yeah, but these are phones that you'll be able to do so much more with than you can right now. I know I would probably want a QNX version phone right now, butI'm more than happy with what OS 7 is offering and the way I've seen it run. A significantly larger processor, web browsing speed, flash capability, NFC, and HD recording? I'll take it, and I'll gladly use it for a couple of years.
The bad part for RIM is that new customers are going to compare the aesthetics to an iphone or an android phone and the large majority will not choose the blackberry because of the buttons.
Even though it is more practical, and faster to have physical buttons, people don't buy phones on those reasons. Nobody wants an ugly high-end phone. And I have to say that the buttons make it look like a 1980s calculator. Straight up. Say word they look like a calculator! Real talk B.
Its the rounded buttons.
I would have just screwed practicality and just went for pure looks on the device if I was RIM, it sells a lot more to the average folk.
That's a no no. Going on just looks will have a high return rate for any product. You won't guarantee longterm sales, and the product would be a failure.
The Storm2 looked great and actually worked well, but it wasn't received well due to os and hardware issues. It was just limited by the software and power specs. That plus the failures of the Storm1 tarnished the name. Hopefully this 9850/60 turns into a Storm and redeems the series.
That's why it's important to see a project through it's entirety, and not just on one aspect like looks. It has to be more than solid. It has to be damn good.
Very nice post Chiefbroski.....think you nailed the truth.The new customers will definately go for the looks and comapre them with other andriod and iphones..and now that iphone has the prepaid version and 3gs for practically free.They need to act fast.
It's becoming old hat seeing pictures of these phones. RIM needs to just release the darn things already. People are practically lined up seething to give RIM their hard earned cash, but they can't even announce when they'll be out yet. My guess is that we won't see these until no sooner than late August at this point.
Daag I wish they would have a front-facing camera! And a hot spot! I have lots of out-of-town relatives and it's nice being able to "see" them when we talk. Other than that, love the look!
That being said, I'm thinking the pic is photo-shopped. The shadows on the hand don't look right. What's causing that curvy shadow by the thumb?
Coming from this design/illustration/digital media major and longtime artist...this is clearly not photoshopped at all. Lighting has so many obstacles that go beyond what you see in the picture. It's a perfectly natural shot. No Area 51 secret stuff going on here folks.
Whether or not thats a Torch or Storm or any other title, I wish RIM would give up on touch only phones. Do what you are good at, QWERTY keyboards!!! That phone does not appear to have a slider keyboard at all. I luv my Torch in having a touch screen, slider keyboard, and trackpad. As for the buttons looking cheap? I dunno, I don't see it that way, BB's tend to be well built and I have never broken one. The slab touch only phones always looked cheap to me...
Am I the only one that doesn't see a torch on the picture? Looks like the Monaco/Storm3
Everything about it says Storm except for the trackpad and lack of SurePress. Sadly, it's labeled a Torch.
Idk what everyone is complaining about the 9850 is one hell of a sexy beast! I actually like the physical buttons. I have tried the Samsung Galaxy S and you can't tell which button is where or which in the dark until they light up and it's sooo annoying! The ONLY thing I'm not happy with is that the phones aren't dual core, don't have a front facing camera and don't have HDMI out.
as much as I want to see RIM succeed...they are on a downward spiral.
I was contemplating on buying the full touchscreen (Torch/Monaco) or the Bold Touch, but after seeing those buttons on the Torch (which makes the device look terribly ugly and, it looks too long), it makes it easier to get the Bold Touch.
I have not really been a fan of the Bold series, my BBs have always been touchscreen (Storm 2-Torch), but with the way that phone looks, I think it's finally time to try the Bold series.
The good thing is that this Bold has a touchscreen...which even makes it easier for me to switch.
However, I was really hoping to get the full Touchscreen (nothing like browsing on a full touchscreen with sweet display), but RIM did what it does best...DISAPPOINT!
What were they thinking when they put those horrible buttons?
They just never want to get things right for some reason.
The same thing happened to the Storm series, when they introduced the surepress...some people liked it, while majority didn't, and when majority of the customers don't like a product, it affects sales and reviews of that product.
I see the same thing happening with this 9850, few people would like the buttons, while majority would be disappointed with those ugly buttons.
The question is; why did they even consider putting those buttons? I mean; full Touchscreen Phones are supposed to be flat, which makes them really cool looking.
RIM, RIM, RIM...when would these disappointments finally come to an end?
I was really hoping to get the full touchscreen, but I can't stand those buttons...ewww!
the physical buttons will make the phone much easier to navigate then the flat unseen buttons of the torch. My torch sounds like a squeaky old bed because of the one-piece-of-plastic-four-button thingy, and i constantly press the wrong ones because when i operate my phone i look at the screen and not the buttons. i use my phone extremly fast. always i have to wait for the OS windows to get to where i want them to go so when i press buttons, i don't look i do it from memory. Unfortunately because i can't feel them i don't actually know where they start and where they end, therefore i very often press the wrong ones. Also on the torch the more you use a button, the harder it becomes to press. At least on mine. The physical buttons will i; eliminate the squeakiness and ii; you can train urself to not misspress because you can actually feel the damn buttons. This will make using this phone much more enjoyable especially on OS6.1..er..7, sorry.
look at it this way. With a 3.7 inch screen your thumb will be doing a lot of work, okay. It will be covering a lot of real estate so by the time it'll come down to press a button, it will be fairly stretched out and have weaker button pressing power(tm), lol. So you need buttons that are very easy to press hence why they stick out. You can even side-tap them as opposed to the one-pice-of-plastic buttons which you need to actually depress with effort, and that becomes difficult when your thumb is either fully extended or at an awkward position.
i don't care if it makes it uglier, just as long as it has a purpose and if it has to sacrifice design over functionality, then i really don't mind. I welcome the physical buttons. Come to daddy, lol.
'RIM suck' hahahaha...............
BOOORRIINNGGGG!! Tell you what; stop writing about the damn Bold Touch until it's actually released, because it's now getting really old and i am already over it!
I probably won't upgrade now until the QNX phones....RIM suck at marketing. Awful.
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
look at that giant mutha-effin display on my b*tch touch! dang!!!!!
I think the Torch Touch/Monza/Monaco, or whatever it is looks pretty nice. Maybe not quite enough to bring me back to BB yet, but if it had been out three months ago I might have stayed on BB.
Those ugly buttons are for the birds. Totally takes away from the device. When you see the two together side by side the 9860 looks out classed big time. The bold touch is sharp and classy. The torch looks clunky and frumpy. I really don't understand why the design is so subpar. Really a bad move by RIM.
Those ugly buttons are for the birds. Totally takes away from the device. When you see the two together side by side the 9860 looks out classed big time. The bold touch is sharp and classy. The torch looks clunky and frumpy. I really don't understand why the design is so subpar. Really a bad move by RIM.
That would make sense that the phone on the left is the Curve Touch. It does look kinda small! It looks real skinny next to the Bold Touch! All I got to say that my Storm2 does look better with the flush buttons but still the phone on the left is not ugly at all! I will definitely rock that phone if is indeed the Torch 9850/60! It will still be the Storm3 to me! Once a Stormer, always a Stormer!
I still think it's photo shopped in a way.
Or he has some HUGE hands. Lighting and shadowing aren't exactly right for this image to be authentic...
Although, I could be wrong.
Also, that Torch/Touch is fugly!
I'll just stick with my good ol' 9800.
To all those complaining about the physical buttons... Please stop and think for a minute. If those were capacitive touch buttons, how could you use the trackpad effectively?... Ahhh... Get it now? Yeah, they are pretty, but they aren't fugly either.
Err... Current BlackBerry Torch 9800 users seem to be able to use the trackpad just fine. The buttons aren't capacitive (more like the Storm 2 buttons), but they're far from being raised and seem to have no bearing on the effectiveness of the trackpad.
Current Torch users are fine with the trackpad because their buttons are NOT part of the screen. They're raised buttons under that plastic skin.
They added the raised keys on this newly branded Torch to maintain accuracy. Slipping off of the trackpad would likely cause you to slide over one of the virtual buttons (if you will) and cause far too many complaints from the ogres. This is why SurePress was effective. You could have touched the screen, but only clicking the screen would select. It would be perfect for this model.
I'm going to butcher the names of phones for easier understanding.
I think the Curve Touch and the other Higher End Full Touch BB will have slightly different form factors (I hate this term). The raised buttons does make it look a little less refined, I'm going to assume it's the Curve Touch that is being shown. I believe the Higher End Full Touch BB will have the buttons flushed with the rest of the phone.
But I have to agree that the buttons on the 9850 look cheap and out of place. Going with physical buttons they should be more like those on the 9700/9780 contoured to fit the shape of the phone. Looks like a nice phone though.
an epic comment would be the release date of the unreleased phones that blackberry has promised us! And i know that isnt the new torch!!!!!
can't wait to get one of these badboys and have no apps for it
Why would you have no apps for it? RIM said current apps should be forward compatible. At least to the same extent as in the past. What has changed is developers ability to claim compatibility with all devices. They are now forced to individually check each compatible device in AppWorld. So the only apps you will be left out of are probably apps with lazy devs, which in the end you probably don't want anyways. All apps on crackberry should still install fine. Whether they work 100% is another thing but thats expected on every platform not just BB.
I must be the only person that thinks those "buttons" aren't mechanical or raised at all. It looks to me like they are sunken and fully part of the screen which would imply they aren't actually movable.
No, they are seperate raised mechanical buttons. Reminds me of an old Nokia or even some of those ugly Sony Ericsson phones they used to make. Definately got hit with the ugly stick.
I suppose it doesn't matter too much what it looks like so long as it works. And we all know everyone loves the Bold look - even if it's a bit W I D E for some.
This is so annoying.... ***ATTENTION ALL "That's not a Torch, bro" COMMENTERS***
Unless you've been keeping up to date on the unreleased devices yourselves, don't try to correct the writers for CrackBerry. If you have been reading the blogs here and on other sites, you will notice that the device known as the STORM 3/MONACO/MONZA is now ALSO being referred to as the Torch 9850/9860. As a matter of fact, that is the only thing RIM has referred to it as lately. The Storm name has been dead for a while now. And more recently, leaked documents have referred to it as the Monaco/Monza even less. Sounds like it is carrying the Torch name for the time being. I am simply going off of the documents I have seen and that everyone else has had access to. Considering the fact that it has been referred to as such multiple times, it must not be a typo. And while certain websites may still refer to it as the Monaco or Monza, this evidence is trumped by carrier and manufacturer documents that tout it as the Torch 9850/9860. This is an entirely different device than the Torch 9800 and/or the Torch 2 9810.
I personally don't think it should be called a Torch. Intuitively it doesn't make sense but this is how they're doing it. Just like you can have a Droid phone with or without a slider, you will soon be able to have a Torch device, with or without a slider.
At least someone has been paying attention.
I love you for having explained this so awesomely. lol
Not a fan of the raised buttons on the torch. They should have been flush.
the raised buttons are actually very nice. very subtle, excellent tactile feel. MUCH better than flush. Flush were terrible to use.
Yep...i just checked, with the same two devices in hand...no problem...no photo trickery. I don't even have large hands.
If only we were all so lucky as to have those two devices.
is it just me or does this pic look photoshopped? Look at the way the bold is resting on that gigantic hand? not really sure though.
Although it looks odd, I tried it with my 9780 and was able to hold it similarly.
+1
Not photoshopped at all. It's legit.
Hey, that Torch is actually not a torch... really guys, you write for a blackberry site, you should be catching these things.
All documentation points to it being called a Torch. Just because the Torch is also a slider doesnt mean they cant call this a Torch as well. Think Pearl and Pearl flip.
Bold is nice, the other is a shocker! Fell off the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down!
I think they both look awesome and I think I will be picking up the Torch (or whatever they want to call it). BTW- I love the physical buttons. I hate having to take off my gloves in winter just to answer my phone! Now just how long do I have to wait...........doesn't matter though- I am not leaving Blackberry for anything.
Or... scrap the physical buttons for capacitive ones and allow us to use the trackpad (depressed click) to answer calls. Now, everybody wins! :)
The physical buttons are retro now, so its cool. Capacitive buttons are sooooo first half of 2011.... :P
Hey that's not the new torch...
The Torch slider? No, it's not. It however is branded at a Torch now. Odd eh : )
I, for one, don't think that any of these phones look cheap. Even if they did, it's hard to tell from one picture, now isn't it?
Build quality isn't something that RIM has had problems with in the past with their higher-tier phones, so I think these will have good quality. I'm really excited to see more about the Torch 9860, as I don't know as much about it as I do about the Bold 9900.
Wow, are Nokia making the Blackberry handsets now? That Bold Touch looks like an old 7650 I used to have - years ago!
@kevinnugent, since the Bold touch looks like your "stone aged Nokia 7650" I am done with waiting for the release of the 9900. Do me a favor, load up BB7 on your Nokia since your Nokia had a 1.2GHz processor and mail it to me. Thanks!
They both look very cheap. Makes me sad, it looks like the boss walked up with a bunch of old parts and said make a new phone.
I suggest you have a look and the other pics and hands on videos of the Bold Touch. Not only does it look premium but it feels premium too.
Both devices look nice, the only thing that I don't like on the 9860 is the buttons... couldn't they be part of the screen?
if they can play youtube videos quite well, I will definitely be getting one of the new BB's, if not, I might be jumping ship.
That aint a TORCH mate, watch what you post. STEP UP.
Keep up with the news. The all touch device is being branded as a TORCH, just like the slider.
Glad someone reads more then just the titles around here. :)
Yeah.....that's kinda sad to see this far into the comments...lol.
I seriously think this phones coming out late july early august. All these people holding the finished bold must be a sign that RIM is already done with the phone its just the carriers -_-
Their earnings guidance suggests that they are not going to be out by July. Even August is looking doubtful.
I just want the damn phone already.
MY goodness WTF is RIM thinking i was so amped for the blackberry touch/torch w.e they call it until this!!
are you f*ing kidding me they better delay that phone and fix those buttons, i hope someone that have close ties with RIM is reading this because this is one very very angry fan!!
the phone is ugly and if they release that phone i would honestly buy an android until QNX phones come out and i dont want to get an Android phone but RIM is giving me no choice.
then go buy an android and stop crying. the phones haven't even been released. im sure blackberry will take your money when you come crawling back.
Are those phones really small or is a giant holding them?
LOL.
They must be just right, because in other pictures the 9900 looks large.
I think the 4 buttons and trackpad could have advantages. But the buttons look weird for some reason?
They stick out pretty far, that's why. Breaks up the flat nature of the rest of the phone.
they look wiered and moreover dust will accumulate pretty soon like in the earlier BB phones.
I'm pretty confident to say that the one on the left is a Blackberry TOUCH prototype.
Of course, the one on the right is the Blackberry BOLD TOUCH.
The 9850/9860 are not being called BB Touch. Sprint documentation says its a Torch, and I also got separate info from another carrier that says the same. Regardless of what you guys might think, its a Torch, and indeed, that should make sense given the model numbers.
9850 looks cheap. A trackpad on a touchscreen would give you a means for more precise selection of smaller objects on websites i.e. the bottom of forum pages where you would like to select the next page, those numbers are usually small and would be easier to select with the trackpad. Can't wait for that Bold!
That's a Monaco bro.
Noooo! Those physical buttons just look horrible! Please let them be touch! And according to other rumors it won't be called the BlackBerry Torch, instead the Volt.
I wonder if they'd run into legal issues with General Motors for that?
I've never seen the General Motors phone. How do you like it?
Past articles on Crackberry have stated RIM chose not to name this new candybar device the "BlackBerry Touch" in fear of a lawsuit from Apple for copying the name of one of their products (which isn't even a phone). What I was wondering is if GM would go after them as they already have a product called the "Volt" (which also isn't a phone).
Sorry if I wasn't making myself clear, but I think you could have replied in a much more intelligent manner.
Torch?
No, it´s a Storm3!
Storm is dead.. let it die like it should have from the start.
Let the Storm LIVE Bla1ze, lol. Stop HATING on it. Lazaridis was quoted as saying that "SurePress is here to stay" in the All Things D interview before the S2 emerged.
That phone is no where near as bad as you're trying to make people believe. It needed better guts-yes, but SurePress was awesome for many of us. The OS sucked, but I loved the Storm2.
Storm sans SurePress makes more sense. It's far closer to a storm than a Torch. Otherwise we could make the argument that the Bold 9900/9930 should be a Torch without the slider as it's both touch screen and full qwerty.
I personally like the storm. it just needed better software.
Couldnt agree more...it is a great phone! wanted it to b faster ie more responsive i guess.
wtf! this is just getting stupid now
Damn that 9850 looks sick!!
Looks pretty good to me.
If it's anything like that youtube video demo, I'm quite sure that it will be a pretty big hit.
Those buttons on there make that phone look extremely cheap. Not a torch btw
Well it certainly isn't a Storm lol.. All docs say Torch, even the early spec sheets say Torch..so unless you have something to say that I don't know about -- it's a Torch until otherwise proven not to be.
Perhaps it is there to make clicking on links easier?
Torch would mean it's a slider...that thing is full touch.
Based on what? They can name name a device anything they want -- just because you have the Torch as a slider now and the 9810 as a slider doesn't mean they can't brand a non-slider as a Torch. Like I said above -- documentation currently shows it as a Torch.
Personally don't think it should be labled as a Torch but that's what all information suggests -- I've been waiting for someone to have accurate proof of it being something else. Easy to say it's not a Torch but provide no information to the contrary. I sincerly hope someone proves it not to be a Torch.
Click the link and it takes you to the page that says blackberry touch / monza .. So im assuming typo , cuz the torch slides up. But w.e
You're talking to Bla1ze, he wrote the article.
Miss this part of that article?
"Although at the top it does say Torch, that is presumably a typo in the information"
At the time -- it was assumed to be a typo. But with the Sprint info using the Torch branding as well, it's presumably NOT a typo.
Try reading beyond the title next time. ;)
Ive been listening through all the podcasts so i now read these comments in your voice. Thanks on the article and clearing up some of the confusion for some folk. Think you guys should do a 2011 device round up again.
Does the name "Pearl" mean it's a candybar form factor? Think Pearl 8200 and 8230. They are clamshells. RIM clearly uses its branding to appeal to certain consumer/business segment.
The argument could even be as simple as the 9850/9860 not having a surepress screen makes it a Torch, not a Storm.
Personally I don't think the "Touch" name falls in line with RIM's naming scheme... They tend to go for very unique and iconic names. Overall the Torch line has been successful...especially relative to the Storm series. I think it makes sense to go with Torch.
no, that's the new curve touch, not the Torch 2
Some are going to complain about the physical buttons on that Torch.
They look horrible. But what I really hate is the trackpad on touch phone. WHY?????? I feel myself gravitating toward a WP7 even though I love Blackberry. : (
I welcome it, I mean have you ever tried to click the smallest link on a touch screen phone "without" zooming in? Does it work everytime? It just brings another form of navigation, I don't see anything wrong with it.
+1 Trackpad = good
Whyb is what I ask. that the lack of fine tuning the touch screen so u don't need to zoom to hit a key(iphone, and android) is what every touch phone is doing wrong. Unless u have small hands like my 4 year old. That is why I don't have a iphone, plus at least 5 other reason's mainly it's apple.
Having played with the 9900. The stuff are just too small for accurate tapping.
I was still using trackpad and... being a blackberry user for the longest time, touching screen won't really come natural for awhile lol :3
the trackpad is a great inclusion. If you've ever used a torch before you'll realise how awesome it is for that pinpoint accuracy that your fingers won't be able to muster with editing of text and other hard to press buttons on websites etc.
I see no reason to get angry over a button like this?
It's like getting angry over the home button on the iphone.
at first I thought a trackpad added to a full touchscreen, is a no-no...but then I came to understand the benfits of it...now that I see the call/menu/go-back/end call buttons are actual physical buttons, hell NO! Ugly. Cheap. I need a "Full Touchscreen" BlackBerry...I mean they did away with the "click clack clunk" of the S1 and now no more "click clack" like the S2...and if we can't get a REAL "click" screen, n just go for all touchscreen(with a trackpad), then the only other buttons I want to have to push besides that trackpad are the camera and convenience keys
have you used capacitive buttons on those androids. they can be very fickle.
I can understand users wanting them to be flushed into the design e.g the original torch. At least these buttons you won't accidentally slide over them like you can do with a capacitive button (thats if they register your touch properly)
though I can totally see them moving away from these buttons if and when QNX is implemented especially if they decide to take advantage of the bezels. all that said and touch, I'm still loving some hardware buttons and the trackpad.
I thought it was a huge mistake to get rid of the second convenience keys though.
The bold looks nice, the torch ehhhhhh
ditto
Can't wait for the BlackBerry Bold Touch!
And the Monaco/Monza/Touch/Storm3 Torch 9850/9860
Don't they look to small for the hand?
Hmm, small for a Bold Touch - my first thought too ........
Is it just me or does the Monaco/Monza look a little on the long/thin side? Just a bit off balanced. Like it should have been as wide as the Bold. Maybe its just me.