After tonight’s Q1 conference call, just how bad are things for RIM?

By Chris Umiastowski on 28 Jun 2012 09:15 pm EDT
Depressing.  That’s the only word that comes to mind after reading the RIM Q1 financial results press release and listening to the conference call.  

As crappy as the results were, I’m not going to write up a death certificate for RIM here.  Yes, they are in real serious trouble.  No, it won’t be easy to climb back from the position they’re in.  No, they did not inspire any confidence in anybody on that call.  

They need serious help writing conference call scripts and being prepared for obvious questions from analysts.  When the CFO can’t reply to a question without 10 thousand ums and uhs, people assume the worst.  But are they dead?  Let’s discuss it.

First let’s go over the core numbers

Revenue was $2.8 billion for the quarter.  That’s down a whopping 33% from last quarter.  But keep in mind last quarter.  To get a sense of how disappointing this is, the Street was expecting revenue of $3.1 billion.  So it’s a miss of just over 10%  Not pretty.

Earnings-wise, Wall Street expected a small loss (one penny per share).  In reality RIM lost $0.37 per share, which amounts to $192 million.

RIM shipped only 7.8 million BlackBerry devices, compared to Wall Street expectations for 8.7 million.  Again, that’s about a 10% shortfall.  

Thorsten Heins says that the BlackBerry subscriber base is still growing in all regions except the United States, which I find interesting.  Unless he made an error in saying this, it certainly shows staying power for an older platform in most markets.  But I have to wonder how long this can keep happening.

RIM is still cash flow positive.  The media is already screwing this up, so it’s worth spending a moment to make sure this is crystal clear to our readers.  RIM lost money when you look at the income statement.  But a business’ actual cash flow is often very different from accounting profits or losses.

Looking at RIM’s cash flow statement, they generated about $710 million in cash flow from operations.  This is a real number, and they are real dollars.  However, almost $400 million of this came from a reduction in working capital.  This is what happens when you reduce inventory, push out payables and collect receivables.  It is not sustainable, and it should not be considered true cash generation on any ongoing basis.    

Cash is king

So the way I see things, RIM has a business that can still bring in about $300 million per quarter right now, minus some capital spending that will still be required.  Plus, they’re implementing a cost cutting program to save another $1 billion per year (or $250 million per quarter).  This means RIM can probably absorb a decline of another $500 million in cash flow from operations before starting to burn cash.  The caveat is they need to execute on their restructuring plan for this to be true.  Execution hasn’t been a strong point for this company lately.  

For a company in RIM’s position, cash is absolutely critical here.  So while the results are brutal (and the worst part is coming up next), at least they have their cash.  It doesn’t look to me like things will get bad enough to put them into any serious level of cash burn.  At least that’s my current view.

The waiting is the hardest part

What’s the worst part?  BlackBerry 10.  It’s delayed until Q1 of calendar 2013.  That is UGLY.  Unfortunately, I can’t say it’s much of a surprise either. In the last week alone, I had conversations with two very good friends who follow the company as closely as I do.  Both of them felt BlackBerry 10 would stand next to no chance of making it out by the fall, as RIM has previously estimated.  

This is why cash is do damn important.  We’re still seeing people write about how RIM is the next Palm.  And it’s still the crappiest of comparisons you could possibly make.  Palm died because of a cash problem.  I’m not talking about Palm inside of HP.  I’m talking about Palm the publicly traded company that ran out of cash while rolling out WebOS devices.

At the end of the day, as long as you launch a product that the market wants to buy, and you have the cash to bring it to market, you’ll be OK.  Please don’t misinterpret this as me being a RIM bull.  I’m really disappointed in the company, and writing this editorial requires alcoholic beverages be within close range of my keyboard.  

The picture is more grim.  There’s more risk now because the delay gives competitors even more time to pull ahead of RIM, and to catch up in the few remaining areas where RIM excels.  But a delay of BB10 doesn’t mean RIM is dead.

What does a delay really mean?

Let’s look at the example of Microsoft.  To this day many respected industry pundits believe Microsoft will become a successful player in the market.  And this is after years and years of horrible disappointment.  How can anyone say such a thing with a straight face?  It’s because Microsoft has cash.  They have the financial means to support themselves in this market until they get it right.

And what about Apple?  They came in at zero market share.  They delivered an outstanding product and became a hero.  They had the cash to bring their product to market.  

RIM is not Apple.  Obviously.  And they don’t have as much cash as Microsoft either.  But they do have the support of many developers, and they do have enough cash to bring BlackBerry 10 to market.  

The big question is, will BlackBerry 10 be good enough.  THAT is what we need to spend our effort analyzing.   I was happy to hear that Thorsten Heins won’t let the product launch before its ready.  Honestly, I think that would be more of a death blow to RIM than being late.  Being late to a party can be forgiven if you show up and rock the house.  But if you show up with body odor, everyone walks away.  

Reader comments

After tonight’s Q1 conference call, just how bad are things for RIM?


Thanks for the post.
I was looking forward to your article after the call. I dropped from the call itself because I felt like I had been punched hard in the gut.

I knew that a sense of humour or a drinking problem would be needed to weather this one and it seems you have both, which helps. ;-)

Comparisons between RIM and any other organisation are simplistic at best. MSFT is just now releasing a tablet - years after everyone else (as did GOOG) and nobody's complaining that loudly that they're late to the market.

My RRSP demands that RIM shape up but that call was a really truly bad confidence shaker. This is coming from a guy that has two PlayBooks, a number of BlackBerry's (almost 10, I think, somewhere here) and far too many shares of RIM priced well above $30. I'm invested, and the bets are still placed on their success, but I'm not at all happy.

I agree with you. I really hope for the best. I also agree with Chris that releasing something that isn't good enough is worse than a 90 day delay. They need reviews of the first BB10 device to be great and people will buy it. I'm sure there are many BlackBerry owners and more Android and iOS owners waiting for the release of BlackBerry 10 and a 90 day delay isn't going to change that.

the thing is...RIM is dying and considered dead by the general public. At this point, I don't think BB10 matters any more

the current versions of Android and iOS have developed into refined OSes that runs quite smooth; apps and functions included into the OSes are patented material bought from military companies and the likes; social functions are integrated and tied to the platforms

Even BB10's demo does not convince me as a modern os with the layout and the messy peek etc gestures looking like they are trying to adapt modern technology into a system in the 90s.

There is absolutely no way that BB10 is going to put up any fight with the two giants in 2013...definitely not their next gen oses...BB10's demo looks like it would be hard to put up a fight with even the current gen os, let alone something in 2013

Yeah, whatever.
Heard your song, seen your dance
too many times before...
I knew Jack Kennedy.
You, sir, are no Jack Kennedy.

I agree too with a big fan with playbook, torch 9810 and 9900 on the go..this is my setup..and for my collection i buy this week an 7290 vodafone..:-)

I think now is to late for BB10 at all. But but...if they change to android before xmas...and make a qwerty device with all the modern details, then maybe blackberry is again back.... I think america and canada love the blackberry label and we do also here in europe ..maybe here in switzerland not to mutch but england, italy , spain..etc....

The consumers need apps to download, yes maybe they dont use it but they do.... For me a bold 9900 with biger screen and front camera..etc...will be cool never change a winning horses...but change the food of the winning horses or the guy eho ride it..:-)

Sorry for my english volks

Bye longe life to RIM

the existing design of the 9900 with an added front facing camera and android running the hardware would have been enough to put HTC and Samsung to shame.

if only they had any foresight whatsoever to see that scrambling to compete in the consumer market so late in the game was the worse thing they could do. if they had gone this route and secretly worked on BB10 for 2013 or later with no pressure of deadlines to meet, RIM's story would be so different these days.

Dear Canadians,

We have to support RIM until the very END. RIM has become a symbol of pride to every Canadian. I am a Canadian and I don't care if other companys are better than us in technology. I just care that our jobs in Canada depend on this company. If RIM stays alive then we will prosper as a nation. It's not about being faithful to a brand anymore. It's about being loyal to the Canadian flag. Backberry has become our flag of pride. If Blackberry dies, a BIG part of Canada will die too. I will be ashamed to be a Canadian if Blackberry goes under. Everyone in the world will think Canada is a technological ill country. They will think that Canada is not prosperous and we will not benefit from trade with them. I will support Blackberry to the very end. Now is the time to show RIM our support. My current phone is a Blackberry, and my next phone is still going to be a Blackberry.

Loyal Canadian

Dear celine524,

I am almost 60 and plan to get my first wireless phone in 10 years, mostly because I need to be able to communicate. Other functions are important, but none as much as that one.

I can't afford to buy from a company which just might go belly up and leave me with an orphan phone. And I don't care if Canada is seen as technologically ill, sorry. My safety and my wallet come first. Since my carrier does not have the required frequencies for Apple, my phone will be an Android.

That being said, kudos to you for wanting to support Blackberry to the very end. It was definitely my choice when I started examining my options. But now I can't afford to take the chance. I hope I'm wrong.

Your (Blackberry) phone will become an orphan when the US government decides there is a better, more secure option to replace their half a million phones. They have BB servers for each of their depts and this system isnt going anywhere soon. If what you are looking for is a phone for communications.. buy the BB with confidence. Yes.. right now... other phones have better toys and gadgets ... but most will agree the BB is excellent for communication.

I hear this Bolshit being spewed out every day by the ignorant masses and trolls.
There is no risk in buying and using a current BB phone.
It will be supported by the network for the length of even the longest (3 year) contract. Period.

Oh, the sky is falling!

If Blackberry is the only thing that makes you proud to be Canadian, maybe you should think about finding a new home.

Being patriotic is one thing. Blind loyalty to a corporation who just happen to be headquartered in Canada is something completely different.

What a ridiculous thing to say. "just happen to be headquartered in Canada". The technology was conceived, developed and sold by Canadians based in Waterloo, Ontario. Furthermore, there is a direct link between economic prosperity and the strength of the products that we sell to ourselves and the world. You'll be the first to complain when your pension fund loses money and your house prices fall and the government has no tax revenues to pay your health care.

You are vastly overstating RIMs impact on the Canadian economy. Smart pension funds dropped RIMM long ago. And while Blackberry may have started in Canada, they are now a diverse, global company who are headquartered in Canada. They employee canadians, but they also employ workers from all over the world. I have to laugh at your doomsday scenario too. Housing prices falling and no tax revenues because a single company who already receives huge tax breaks may go out of business? Give me a break.

I reiterate: if RIM is the only thing you have to be proud of in Canada, gtfo.

With great reluctance, I have to agree with you. Start planning for the day when you wake up and your phone doesn't work, folks. They're dead in the water.

I am inclined to disagree with waiting another 90 days is best for two reasons.

First off, I feel 90 days is incorrect. RIM optimally needed to release this Q3 2012. To make it in for "back to school" and the Christmas season. This in my opinion, is a 6 month delay.

Secondly, irrelevance.
In terms of hardware, this is a product that was originally designed for Q1 2012. Which if it was complete THEN it would have blown our socks off. Technology moves fast. Releasing Q1 2013 will put the product squarely on 1 year old technology out of the gate. The competition already meets or beats it hardware wise NOW, and you can bet on the fact the competition are already working on their next versions.
The competition now has lots of time to see what RIM is doing and emulate the best parts and integrate them into their OSs. This will make the OS largely irrelvent as well.

In the mean time Apple will release their new phone on time. All those with money for a new phone in their pockets will spend it. Or worse yet, get one on a 3 year contract...

RIM needs to get out of the gate ASAP. even if it's 90% done. Striving for 100% to me is nonsense. They don't know if the customers even care about the last 10%. Get it out working pretty darn good, get feedback, fix/patch what's important. Improve the ecosystem. Get developers up and running again.

RIM NEEDS a product to market. I really don't care if its even the dev alpha device! slap some lipstick on it, toss it in a box and sell it!

In the end, the consumers need something to buy, developers need a platform to develop on. RIM needs to get something out there to maintain relevance in the market.

P.S. I am a avid BB user with 3 playbooks and 2 BB phones just in my household alone(family of 4). I have been using BB for about 7 years now. I would count myself in the top 100 BB fans, and preach it to anyone who will listen. I love BB, but this is just plain crazy.

Prem Watsa had mentioned a few weeks back that it's a 3-5 year investment. He's on the board and Fairfax is very heavily invested. If things were really that ugly, the board would push to action off the assets immediately..they're worth a fortune.

Chris, you made a truly amazing post. There's so much trash out there that I lose faith in humanity sometimes. You explain it exactly as it is..100%

I invested heavily in RIM because I'm a software developer and I understand what RIm is trying to pull off. They have chosen the path of great ambition. Software delays are expected, even this much. I program fluently in 20 languages and I understand technology from ASM to C to JAVA, from Netware, to WINNT, to UNIX to QNX, from scalar processing, to vector processing, from single threading to multithreading to multicore parallel processing and pipelining. Let me tell you these guys at waterloo are top of the world. In fact, Google hires more talent from waterloo, Canada than anywhere else.

When BB10 comes out, it will be breathtaking! There's no doubt in my mind, I have lost tons on my portfolio but i'm not at all worried. I intent to buy more as well. Rim has 78 million paying customers, mostly outside USA but they are keeping the company afloat with enough cash to get by the next 6 months and beyond. USA may have turned their back laughingly on RIM(largely because they love to hate and trash everything Canadian - Canadians are better at everything btw ;), everything except wars..we suck at that!) but the rest of the world is supporting them. Look at the bright side, there will be more apps, hardware will be better and the products will be even better than what would have been released in October. Plus there will be more partnerships. I'm currently working on some great apps and you know what I intend to do with all my earnings?? Use every penny to buy more shares!! They're dirt cheap and the assets are worth a fortune, almost $20 a share!

QNX software is currently installed in all Audi's, most BMW's, Chryslers, Dodge, Jeep, Acuras, electrical grids, nuclear power plants, the internet's core routers, defence systems, high end AV receivers, amazing playbook tablet and is the perfect OS for mobile devices for this decade and the next!. The software is clean, tight, efficient and has been written at the lowest levels. The people writing this software are the envy of all developers. Believe me!

Do it right RIM!!

P.S. Shut up with the good luck with your shares they will be 0 in 3 months... A company with billions in cash and no debt will not go bankrupt. They need to have greater debt than assets to even consider bankrupcy. Stop being so ignorant already.

RIM has an excellent product in QNX and that should survive as a business. Currently the Playbook is almost like a proof of concept for a QNX-based in-car system. RIM might even emerge as a key player in autonomous cars, if Google doesn't get there first or leverage its search advantage.

But the survival of Blackberry as a phone brand now must be extremely doubtful, as its realistic projected future earnings are negative.

Look at it like this: HP abandoned webOS literally coincidentally with the release of the Pre 3, a phone which is still in most ways ahead of anything in BB 7.1, and had features in mid-2011 which RIM won't have until 2013. A platform which is 18 months later than one which was six months too late and so was abandoned really hasn't got a hope in Hell.

u nailed it. even im fed up of all this die RIM trols. i dont understand how people miss the simplest of logic. The company is not in debt, cash flow are ticking in, emerging markets still growing, QNX has lot of potential beyond smart phones, it has the potential (and im sure it is already) to be way ahead of competetion. And i mean ahead of Iphone 5 or 6 whatever. i just wish i could invest in RIM shares. I would put atleast 10-20% of my portfolio in it. unfortunately we have some liimitations on how much one can invest in foregin shares from India.
anyway, coming back to the point, im not a software engineer. but lot of dumb people dont seem to understand the power of QNX. how many OSs in todays market can actually handle multitasking. i mean true multitasking. not the shitty one on apple. BB10 can go beyond smartphones, it can be integrated with your cars, homes, security, its upto ur imagination.
i gues dumb ass will remain dumb asss.

Endure RIM.......Endure. why do we fall? TO RISE!!
RIMPIRE will strike back.

PS: to all dumb ass out there, do u even know how many people will loose their jobs if RIM is to die. BTW thats not gona happen. just think about it before u rant like a school kid who wants candy and wants it now. waiting aint gonna kill u.


LOL- RIMpire will strike back.

Nicely said. Canadians or most of them don't easily give up. In terms of war, look at Vimy. Look at Juno Beach. I am sick and tired of hearing from Canadians who want to see the company go down in flames as though the company has somehow done them personally wrong.

I had this conspiracy theory that it was a campaign to devalue the stock so MS or Google can buy them for cheap :)

Compared to other blogs, it almost seems that 10% at CB are trolls!

I've often wondered why it is allowed to continue uncensored.
I think CrackBerry is more concerned with page hits and post count, than they are about providing a welcoming place for BlackBerry fans.

Thanks for taking the time to write your reply, so all I have to do is say "I agree wholeheartedly".

BB10 will rock, and I think the world will be poorer if RIM doesn't remain viable as an independent company... I think the world would be a better place if Palm survived, but what Palm lacked (a strong non-US install base and international network infrastructure to leverage) RIM has in spades, and I think that will make all the difference.

RIM's doing SO MUCH RIGHT that it's a shame that it's not happening faster, is all.

Microsoft can afford to fail several more times.

And Google have waited exactly the right amount of time before own-branding a tablet: until a 7 inch tablet works really well and can be made cheaply, leaving Samsung and RIM to iron out all the potential problems of the form factor.

At this point the only reason to buy a Playbook is because you need more than 16Gbytes on a tablet. That is at best a very niche market.

2013 is simply too late. That will be after the release of the successors to the S3 and the HTC One X - which are already amazingly good.

Even the RIM advantage of cheap NFC in low end phones has just been negated by Google/Asus putting it in their $200 tablet.

I am really saddened by this, but that was a long suicide note.

The only difference is the Cash Flow!

MSFT makes enough from Windows/Office and Google makes enough from Search. They can afford to lose and wait for the Mobile product/ecosystem to succeed in long term.

How long can RIM survive without a new product? RIM is suffering a dying cycle and they desperately need new product.

Poor earning -> cut cost -> fire more people -> delay new product -> lose more market share -> poor earning -> ...

RIM is running out of chips to play this mobile game.

They need a back up plan for QNX. I hope they can reconsider making Android blackberry device. It doesn't take long to make an Android device, but it will provide enough cash flow for Blackberry to survive.

I ll be sorry to see RIM go like this. They make the best hardware in mobile market.

Hands down the best hardware. However, going Android will kill the company. It isn't even an option as they have to support BIS, BES and other business infrastructure they sell, like Fusion. It isn't even an option.

Once again Chris, great post. Especially outlining the cash position and defying some media of the fact that RIM is actually not burning cash overall.

However, we all know that RIM is losing large amount of money on their hardware business. Despite it coming 'close' to analyst consensus, it is still alarming that even though RIM has 'averaged' 10 million units shipped per quarter for the last two years, they are now only shipping 7.8 million. They have also average about $4B in revenue per quarter for the last two years, and now they are only brining in $2.8B. And net income, very very disappointing. I would be very surprised if they can keep up without burning cash. Listening to the conference call, one of the Q&A answers addressed the 'cash burning' question and if I recall correctly it was admitted that cash will start to decline, 'burn' in the future.

I'd be pretty surprised if RIM doesn't start burning cash before they get BB10 out. It's going to take time, and BB7 sales haven't been as strong as they hoped, for some reason. That all leads to a cash crunch at some point. But they have a nice nest egg, so as Chris points out, RIM != Palm.

And thus, as Chris says, it all comes down to how good BB10 is.

There's a huge difference between Microsoft and RIM with regard to cash position - to the tune of $57 Billion. Microsoft can still afford to only hit on one third of their efforts and still be OK. RIM has to execute on BB10 or they will be done. They can't afford another swing and miss.

The difference is even bigger as Microsoft will have a mobile OS that everybody is/will be familiar with.

Besides, developer support is not as big of a problem for WP7/8 as it is for PBOS/BB10.

BB7 sales haven't been strong because BB10 was expected for the fall. Now that it is delayed to 2013, and considering RIM's current position, I'm afraid the BB7 may sell even less.

I've only ever used a BB, I'm now seriously considering looking for a new phone as sad as it is to say.

I am also but I love the keyboards so much and my 4G 9810 is ok so I will wait and see. Its killing me though as a BB10 Bold may not be here till a year from now!

Nope... that's an unfair and unrealistic thing to ask a customer to do.

Sorry, but there's no way in hell I'd go for a *platform* that'll be outdated in 6 - 9 months when the new devices come out -- BB10 *is* a whole new platform, after all. On top of the fact I'd have to keep my OS7 device until mid-2014 and be an OS behind, *again*.

I held out for BB10 as long as I could, but I couldn't deal with my 9700 anymore (OS6 is less than stellar on that device, plus I needed IMAP support and, well, reliability -- my phone would crash every 2 days or so), so I jumped ship to Android, and for a BB fanatic, I can't believe how much more I like the Android platform (then again, I was a Linux admin -- going to Android was like coming home).

I like your closing comment. I wrote recently "any time I hear about a delay, even though it does hurt, it's a reminder that the people making the decisions aren't willing to make short term compromises that will damage the long term success of the platform."

The problem here is that they've earned the reputation of doing precisely the reverse - think Playbook, 9900 nuking problem, and the fact that they released two incremental handset upgrades after releasing imperfect first models (Storm, Tour).

Only problem with the "it's ok they delayed it because we don't want a half-baked device" outlook is we have heard this many times before. Then the device Is delayed AND buggy. Search through CrackBerry history and you will see this. I have little confidence that it will be bug free, since they seem to be repeating the past. I hope I'm wrong. I want a BlackBerry 10 device.

I like your conclusion!

Meh they might be late, but so long they have a good product it'd be okay ;)

It's time to go private and do things quietly without too many public mistakes by RIM and too many death wishes of all the press and bloggers.

No, I think you need to get a dose of reality.

I am really sad about the uncontrolled descent into terrain of a company that wasn't American, Korean or Chinese and at one time was a world leader. But even people who like a company and its products have to get realistic at some point. Rather than post any more depressing stuff I will most likely abandon posting on Crackberry.

RIM may well prosper in its other fields, but I think now that the Blackberry brand may be sold off in the end to a luxury goods maker who will repackage high end phone internals. Or perhaps Microsoft will buy it to get rid of the disastrous association with Nokia.

Yeah, because "Goodbye, thanks for the memories" adds so much more to the site.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

I don't think I need a dose of anything. I understand perfectly well what is going on in Waterloo and can analyze the financial statements to back up my assumptions.

I will respond to this because I think you could do with some understanding of factors outside financial statements.

My company is in the process of developing a vertically integrated solution for a particular industry. When we started, there were reasons why Blackberry was a good fit as a platform, and the Playbook appeared to be superior as a delivery platform to the competition. The apparently upcoming BB10 phones would also have worked for the more mobile workers.

Now in mid-2012 the Nexus 7 is an even better fit, and the wide range of up market Android phones gives us a readily available highly mobile platform with a range of options. This announcement means that for us, BB10 as a platform is dead. It won't be available until long after customer buying decisions. Although there are technical issues I would prefer not to have, Android is where we have to go.

Hence my sadness; I've invested considerable personal effort into understanding the BB programming environment and ecosystem. I feel let down. I imagine that other vertical market developers are also looking at the Nexus 7 and the various Android phones and making exactly the same decision.

All I can say is........ I fear for RIM.............

A lot of people are due for upgrades soon - and people are not going to upgrade from a Blackberry 7 device to ANOTHER blackberry 7 device.

Yip. I am due for phone upgrade since June and was willing to wait for BB10, but now I can just as well dump my 9930 and move to Android. At least I have a gazillion options in Android.

All I can say is........ I fear for RIM.............

A lot of people are due for upgrades soon - and people are not going to upgrade from a Blackberry 7 device to ANOTHER blackberry 7 device.

aH Alas, I thought I was going to buy a black berry phone in September or October but RIM is still RIM. I guess Iphone 5 it is for me. With how F up things up are right now RIM decide to push back the release. Apple will sodomize(no Vaseline either) RIM with the iphone 5 with no courtesy of giving BB10 a reach around. It's freaking sad man, I was willing to wait another 3 months for a black berry smh

You'll be waiting atleast another 3 months for iphone 5. If the earliest of rumors are correct. Some have the real release to be around january of 2013. Im bored of my 9900, I want something fresh. Apple and RIM are competing for my business, whoever gets there next gen device out there sooner im all over it.

You think Apple will not take advantage of this? You think they want to compete with a better OS? Nope, they are going for the kill, they going to release their latest phone in iphone5 and kill BlackBerry once and for all. If I was a businessman that's what I'll do and that's what the rotten Apple will do

Your assuming apple see's blackberry as competition. I doubt they see blackberry 10 as a big enough threat to schedule the release of there next generation phone around it. The iphone 5 will be out on the same schedule, regardless of how bad RIM misses the ball on there next gen device.

It doesn't matter. It could be the biggest POS in the world and people will still buy it if Apple markets it right. Point is Apple will release using the same schedule and they will sell millions and millions in days while RIM won't have a new device to try and compete.

Sorry Chris but RIM has completely screwed the BB10 developers. Even up to last week, they (Heins' and crew) have been saying that BB10 devices were still on target to launch "later this year". Bullsh*t. They've known for a while that wasn't the case. They are LIARS just as Jim and Mike were.

They've got no credibility with the Street(s) (haven't had it for a long while now) and now they've got no credibility the app developers. Even if the BB10 is the greatest thing since sliced bread, there won't be any apps for it!!

There is no such thing as "perfect" software or hardware. I've always said that they are much better off releasing a product that is 80% complete (I really believe in the 80/20 rule). This just shows me that they have no intention of ever launching BB10.

Umm...the 80/20 rule is a concept where the 20 percent is more important and a more significant contributor than the 80 percent.

The concept is that 80% of the people only use 20% of the features most of the time which means that you only really need to focus on those specific 20% of the features and make sure they are damn good and stable because they will be used by 80% of your base nearly all the time.

The concept is that 80% of the people only use 20% of the features most of the time which means that you only really need to focus on those specific 20% of the features and make sure they are damn good and stable because they will be used by 80% of your base nearly all the time.

I don't know where you got your info, but I am a developer. And I checked with the group of developers that attended the BB10Jam session.

There still committed to delivering BB10 applications.

Truth be told, I feel like I got some breathing room actually to finish my application and not rush it.

And yes there is "perfect" software in a sense that it performs and meets expectations. That was what iOS was when it released. The 80% complete was what Playbook 1.0.4 was when that was released...

I know I'm still committed to BB- but I also know a lot of people who have become disillusioned with RIM today. They feel betrayed & lied to

I know I'm still committed to BB- but I also know a lot of people who have become disillusioned with RIM today. They feel betrayed & lied to

I am very disappointed hearing all this..I have been waiting for BB10 for almost late last year when I was due upgrade in Oct 2011 and I decided to wait out for the new BB that was due early 2012 and then it was delayed to oct 2012 and now Q1 2013. How long can I hold onto my old dying curve 8900 when my carrier Tmobile stopped selling the BBs long ago and the bold is priced so high that it does not make any sense to buy now and get locked for 2yrs...

It's bad news for a company when all people talk about is how they will retain their mound of cash, as opposed to talking about their products.

Between now and the launch of BB10, they'll need to cut everything to retain cash, else by the time they get to advertise and launch BB10, they'll be broke. And if BB10 has a soft launch, it's time for a garage sale. It probably sucks working there right now.

"writing this editorial requires alcoholic beverages be within close range of my keyboard."

- This to me is why you're not very credible. Still emotional investment and commentary. Substituting reality for wishes.

"But they do have the support of many developers"

- No, they don't. Developers have repeatedly demonstrated BB is the platform they are *least* interested in. Hobbyists turning up at a free event to get a free device & free food != support of developers (or, real developers who make the apps you know and love on iOS & Android, at least)

"I was happy to hear that Thorsten Heins won’t let the product launch before its ready"

- His definition of ready will be different from everyone else's. Stable? Perhaps. Competitive feature and ecosystem wise with iOS or Android? Not a chance in hell

"This to me is why you're not very credible. Still emotional investment and commentary. Substituting reality for wishes."

- Dude, this is a fan-site. It doesn't present itself as a news vendor although they try to be a decent source of news for BlackBerry fans. Also, as a FAN he is voicing his opinion with the added finance background that he has. Lastly, it's called humour - you should look it up.

"No, they don't. Developers have repeatedly demonstrated BB is the platform they are *least* interested in. Hobbyists turning up at a free event to get a free device & free food != support of developers (or, real developers who make the apps you know and love on iOS & Android, at least)"

- Yes, free food and free devices. Didn't your mother ever tell you "You get more bees with honey than vinegar."? I think everyone including RIM knows that OS 7 and below was terrible to develop for. BB10 is apparently quite easy to develop for, and porting over iOS apps has been shown to be a breeze. Developers write for iOS first, then Android. RIM isn't trying to make them code for BB10 first, they just need them to develop in the first place. To take Chris' analogy further, when you're at a party it doesn't matter if everyone gets a beer before you, it just matters that you get your beer at all.

"His definition of ready will be different from everyone else's. Stable? Perhaps. Competitive feature and ecosystem wise with iOS or Android? Not a chance in hell"

- And your definition of ready is the same as everyone else's? Competitive features alone are subjective. Are you talking about enterprise or consumer features? RIM is still the best at enterprise and security, but they lag in the consumer market. Do you even know the range of features of BB10 or the hardware they'll run on (besides the screen on a prototype that already beats the iPhone's)? We don' please enlighten us as to what you know about it that defines it as being uncompetitive. You win one point on ecosystems, RIM doesn't have one as complete as iOS or Android - but then again, not everyone shares the same opinion as you that Apple's walled garden is a competitive feature.

"This to me is why you're not very credible. Still emotional investment and commentary. Substituting reality for wishes."

- Nothing is wrong with having a drink while writing a post. If you still think so, I guess all business deals done over while and drink are hogwash to you...

"No, they don't. Developers have repeatedly demonstrated BB is the platform they are *least* interested in. Hobbyists turning up at a free event to get a free device & free food != support of developers (or, real developers who make the apps you know and love on iOS & Android, at least)"

Again your saying nonsense. Not only does ACTUAL discussions in the dev community prove it, I will reference this CNET article:

"They're developing the whole operating system based on our needs with our input," one developer, Matt Lewandowsky, told me. "[BlackBerry 10] could be the first mobile operating system that's truly developer-friendly."

"Competitive feature and ecosystem wise with iOS or Android? Not a chance in hell"

Very subjective statement on your part. Ecosystem wise, who knows, but competitive features? From what I've seen developing on BB10, they are matching on par)...

Losing with slanted, wishful hatred.
You, sir, are obviously not drinking enough.
(and could obviously use some surgery on that sphincter )

I'm curious where you think they are losing hundreds of million of dollars every month when they INCREASED the cash position on their balance sheet this quarter.

Marko.. you don't know what you are talking about so just shut up. Losses were NON CASH losses... merely accounting treatments. Read the f_cking article if you don't know what you are talking about...

Does this mean that BB 10 will have updated hardware, because if they are as much as 6 months late they will just get passed by everyone out their again. How many new phones will be released between Oct 2012 and say March 2013. That is a life time and I hope with the work they are doing on the software they will not forget to bring up the specs on the hardware as well. We want a freaking phone that will compete. But bloody hell, with the delay it seems this new RIM is not falling too far from the tree of the old RIM.

An analyst actually aksed TH this question in the Q&A following and he said the specs on the new phone are state of the art and the delay wouldn't change that - at least that's how I heard it. He also said that BB10 is more about the software and the new experience than it is about the hardware.

I wish the mods would delete your account and never let you back on this site. You are nothing but an annoying pr_ck with nothing better to do but be a jackass. You hate RIM...we get f_ck off!!

Sad to admit RIM needs to build an alliance with Samsung or get sold to them. They won't make it till BB10, the horizon it's horrible

It's over for RIM. Let the looting begin. I hate it but I too will be looking into Android. Let the damn learning curve begin. RIM, you tried to be everything to everyone and it was an epic fail. You owned the business market and failed to continue improving that aspect of the business when you began focusing on being a "toy." Touchscreens and games are for babies. We want to type out our text mssgs and were amazed at the email capabilites which placed you on the map. RIP.

A great post, Chris.

Listening to your comments about cash towards the end of your podcast (essentially repeated here) reminded me of a situation of Palm vs RIM around 2000. Palm's CEO was speaking at a Toronto computer conference. I was not impressed at the time with Palm's chances for success. Palm only had about $100MM in cash at the time; RIM had just completed a market raise of about $900MM. And you just knew who was going to win that game at the time.

Yes, the BB10 news is disappointing. It better win on the user experience. From what I have seen it has the potential to do so given both my positive experience with the PlayBook and also my long history of being involved with selling true multi-tasking solutions (even on mini-computers at one time) and its ability to improve user productivity. But the opportunity window is running short.

The waiting just became the harder part!! It will test the loyalty of dedicated BlackBerry fans.

Jim Courtney
Editor and Publisher
Voice On The Web

"Being late to a party can be forgiven if you show up and rock the house.  But if you show up with body odor, everyone walks away."


I think you nailed it Chris, great article and a good point on cash being king. My biggest worry now is just potential hostile takeovers. With RIM at rock bottom, what the media says doesn't matter anymore - it's already in the dumps. I just hope RIM can continue to focus on BB10 and not have to commit time and resources to fending off other players or managing a merger.

Unless of course, Chris you have some friends in the PE circle that have faith in RIM, are looking for a value and growth story and completely content taking a hands off approach with managing RIM after taking it private ;)

Good article Chris. Doom and gloom is defiantly in the air, at least from this BB addict. I was really looking forward to BB10 but now I feel like I was frozen in carbonite, my friend got into a fight with his father and got his arm cut off. Rimpire Strikes Back Indeed!

I've said this before, and I'll say it again: RIM's issues are internal and cultural, resulting in ineffective communication, which all ultimately lead to products delays and failures.

You can read my blog post detailing my issues with them.

I'll still be working hard on my BlackBerry 10 apps, but suffice it to say, I am not happy, and I will be scrutinizing them even more.

Founder of Pulsecode Engineering and taab

Desktop Bridge for the BlackBerry Playbook
twitter: #DesktopBridge

I can't believe how this company can continually disappoint. It is like Nortel, nothing but bad news. Thanks for throwing my $32K away RIM and Nortel...only $27K. Completely pathetic management. I work for a provincial government in application development and even we can deliver on time. Is RIM using Lean Kanban processes for their work...if not, they had better get with it.

game over im afraid. by then their hardware will be too far behind for any big numbers of new users to want to give Blackberry 10 a try.

as for waiting for it to be "perfect", RIM has never come close to that, zero confidence they can now.

With the stock at $7.86 in after hours trading, they are valued at $4.12 Billion. If it drops any further (down to $4.20) they can buy themselves back and go private.

That would be the same thinking that you can tow yourself out of being stuck in a ditch... lol... Use their public owned and traded cash to buy themselves? Let me know when you get tired of chasing your tail.

I will start by saying that I am a portfolio manager and that I feel Chris has a very straight forward view of the RIM predicament and puts forward a relatively non-biased point of view. I also think the articles he writes are, for the most part well considered and insightfful.

My biggest worry as a Portfolio Manager is hubris - and trying to prove myself right. When it comes to RIM I have owned a BB for years and I bought a Playbook. My bias is that I want RIM to succeed. I am also a Canadian, so I carry that bias as well. I have never shorted RIM nor bought a PUT. Somehow it seems wrong and bad spirited. I really want RIM to turn around and I think the Playbook and QNX is fantastic.

That said...,
I really don't see a way forward for a firm that CANNOT, ABSOLUTELY CANNOT keep a deadline and that will fail to capture the back to school or the holiday market.

Further to this, I think this will materially impact developers' decision to develop for the platform.

RIM is losing there BES revenue and now are giving corporations no reason to keep them.

With this delay I see almost no hope barring going private.

RIM has lost any goodwill they may have hoped to have and may vert well have lost all hope of recovering.

I could be fantastically wrong, and I hope I am. I have no dog in this fight as I have no long nor short position.

But RIM may well and truly be done.

I hope and pray it is otherwise. But I wouldn't bet on it.

RIM that is the worst news!! Still things haven't improved, delay in launch of PB and now BB10!! just pure disappointment.

I love my Blackberry but the writting is on the wall and I must face the facts. With two or possibly three more quarters of surviving with the Blackberry 7 Rim will burn up all their cash. The delay of Blackberry 10 is the death nail in all of our hearts and Rim has really boxed themselves into a corner. Their only option is to go big time into the India and Asian markets and leave the North American market behind.

Great article Chris!! You are (for the most part) preaching to the choir.

I just really like the brand (BlackBerry), but I was truly gutted when I first heard the news that BB10 was going to be delayed. I even heard the opening salvo from the 'RIM is Dead' camp; "Oh, well, when it finally does get released their (RIM's) hardware will be so out of date it won't be funny"

I hope that RIM can continue to innovate until their hardware matches the times (What I mean is, I hope that when BB10 is released, that their handsets are at least in the same ballpark as the current crop of devices from other manufacturers)

With all the speculation (What the problem(s) could be, when in Q1 (90 days to choose from), is it a BBM integration problem (I personally think that is crazy), etc...) It's difficult to know the truth, and that is dangerous for RIM. The general populace do not like uncertainty. Even with the knowledge that BB10 was going to be available at some point in the fall, Enterprise and North American consumer market share have been going downhill, and I do not know if this latest failure to meet their target deadlines will truly be the final straw, but I do know any way you look at their future in the mobile market is slimming.

With the exception of some of the tech savvy bloggers and other forums like crackberry, there really are no positive stories about RIM. Financial blogs and analysis sites practically eviscerate RIM every chance they get. The problem? The general consumer DOES get to see those. It doesn't help.

The waiting is the hardest part? Well, yes and no. See, waiting just takes patience, and I have tons of that. It's more along the lines of waiting while you have one person on each side of you shouting into your ears that you are a dinosaur, RIM is dead, you are a fool for not switching to (Insert Mobile Platform of choice here --->_____________), blah, blah, blah. It get's very old, very fast.

I truly do hope RIM can either rise from this, or at the very least, hang on for dear life until they can release their new OS and hardware. I also hope it's all that and a bag of chips!!! I still would like to believe that they have a shot.

The truth is, I don't know. I'm not a financial analyst or a Fortune 500 CEO, so I really can't comment on the business side. It would be speculation, and after the last year, I have had enough of that, thank you very much!

If RIM does bite the dust, then all tech users have lost a little. Consumers prosper when they are presented with choice, and with one manufacturer gone, that means less choice for us.

As far as cb goes. I would just like to point out, while some of us may feel anger or disappointment in RIM's direction, or lack thereof. There are still 79,000,000 BB users who may still need some help with their BBs, so let's not disappoint em ;)

Wake up people? Do you want them to rush a product like the PlayBook, and have the media crap all over them again? The media LOVE crappin all over Mike and Jim's company because Jim made himself out to be too much of a big shot.

I would rather have them take an extra 3 or 4 months .... even 6 months .... and introduce a product that is well thought out, is tested to the nines, and will blow people's mind ... and will get everyone talking about it.

RIM is still selling 90,000 phones EVERY SINGLE day of the year! That is pretty good ... not compared to some competitors .... but build an AWESOME phone, and that number will go up.

Look what happened to Nokia .... they make a phone with flaws .... and now they have to give it away for FREE.

It's nice to see that the 6.6 BILLION people outside of North America love the brand.


What makes u think they won't release a half assed product regardless. With the news today Rim proved again that it can't deliver on time or deliver a complete product.

I wish the mods would delete your account and never let you back on this site. You are nothing but an annoying pr_ck with nothing better to do but be a jackass. You hate RIM...we get f_ck off!!

I always enjoy reading Chris' analysis and want RIM to do well. However, Crackberry has been repeating the Mantra that all of the negative news is largely due to past decisions but I don't think that is true at all.

Companies that are confident in future growth would not layoff 30% of the workforce because real cash savings will be delayed due to severance. RIM is bleeding market share in the US and does not have a competitive product in the near future and when BB10 does come out I doubt it will be compare to the phones from Samsung.

Delaying the BB10 launch so that it is "Perfect" is total BS. The previous excuse was due to unavailability of chips. I believe there have been serious development challenges for some time. Another product delay does nothing to restore credibility.

Seems like most of you have stuck with BB for the entire time and never used another. I switched to an iPhone 4 2 years ago and after jailbreaking it and tweaking it to try to make me be more productive like a Blackberry I'm going back. Once you tweak iOS to be more productive and do more it craps out. I'm up for an upgrade in August and was planning on holding out for BB10 but I'm not going to the iphone 5 or an Android. A BB7 device for me is better than an iphone or Android at this point. I miss the BB experience..and the light! I've done the fancy UI, app downloading craze dance and it all wears off in the end down to a handful of apps. I don't understand why people can't be happy with a BB7 device for 6 more months.

I am a newer Blackberry owner, I started wit BB6 on a Style and a 9800 Torch. Both sold me, so I was able to upgrade to the 9930 and 9810 and love them. But, as a Sprint customer I have my last annual upgrade this year due in 33 days. I was going to hold out for a BB10 device, but I will lose the upgrade 1/1/13. Another delay, sorry I love my PlayBook and my Berries but I am afraid that I am not willing to invest my purchasing dollars to a company that is going to continue to slide. I doubt that the hardware of the first BB10 device will be current with iOS, Android, or even Windows 8 phones. I bought a Palm Pre and loved it but they died because they didn't keep up. Now I have the same feeling about RIM. No, I think they will continue to serve a niche market (governments and security sensitive large corporations) for a time but they will continue to loose market among consumers in North America and Europe especially in the high end market. I admit I am sad, but it looks like I will be upgrading to something in 33 days or so not in October and it will not be a BlackBerry.

Wow. BB10 is going to miss back-to-school and the holiday season, and come out after iPhone 5. Can you say 'Worst product launch ever'?

All you BB owners who are now looking at buying Android or Apple, WHY? They are still selling BB's. If you chose BB over Android/Apple last time, then what's changed?

Simple, last time I bought a BlackBerry it wasn't a dead end product. Now it is. My contract isn't up until October 2013, so I fully expect that buying a BlackBerry at that point (if one still can) would be like walking around with a Treo in 2009.

A new generation of smart phone users will be purchasing phones by the holidays. Thanks to RIM really screwing the pooch, they've lost out on the opportunity to get a quality product out that could be talked about. I hate the excuse of, "We want everything to be perfect." Nothing will be perfect. Last time I checked, OS 2.0 isn't perfect for my PB but it was still released. It pretty much says to me that they still don't know what the he!! they're doing up there. The Iphone 5 + various Samsung devices are now in a perfect position to own the market for years to come.

haha yeah, the ceo saying "i won't release it unless it's perfect" really makes my head spin. it's like "really buddy, pretty sure you were totally in charge of the storm"

Nice to see Mr. Heinz can learn from past mistakes.
Not so nice to see katiepea still trolling CrackBerry. RIP Katiepea.

i sense that people in Crackberry have been emotional over the delay. More or less, your posts affected some readers to migrate to other device.

It's not our job to keep people using BlackBerry devices. That's RIMs job. We really don't have much to work with. A 6-9 month wait for a new device when you're ready to updrade is not in RIMs favor. BlackBerry 0S7 is great and I'd recommand anyone getting one. Get one off contract to hold you over til BlackBerry 10.

Why do we fall? To rise!!
Hang on in there RIM. There are still people who believe in u, there are still markets that are growing, there is light at the end of the tunnel no matter how dim it is there is still hope.
Just keep focusing on emerging markets to push all OS7 devices, keep healthy cash levels and once BB10 hits the market, in 6-12 months time things will be back to normal. Till then endure...endure all the pain, criticism. After all why do we fall......TO RISE!!!!
And if it is to be the end, let's us make it worthy an end. Show the world what BB10 and PB are all about.

BB forever, RIMPIRE "will" strike back.

Great piece, Chris. BB10 really needs to rock the house. But to be honest it's hard to see how they will be able to as Apple, Google and Microsoft steadily pull ahead in terms of services, products, and in particular, ecosystem.

Yet another story showing just how incompetent, tone deaf to its customers, and negligent of its customers that RIM has become. Hey executives of RIM. Have any of you dumbasses read ANY of the comments re:this article or the other comments in the Forum section tonight? Do you GET IT that BB loyal customers are leaving BB because of your incompetence? Do you care at all? BB's going to fold, because you executives don't give one damn. Well, you've strung us along enough. We're looking elsewhere. Droid and iPhone don't seem to have "issues" that are self inflicted. Read Crackberry forums, you dumb, stupid execs. You're getting a BIG f.u. From your former, loyal customers that you screwed over.

Also looking fwd for James's post. If u already wfinished ur post sorry will read it later. This is the first article I'm readin in the morning. Its GMT + 5:30 hrs

RIM defiantly has to focus on marketing BB10. They need to sell this phone as the most productive phone on the market for productive people. If there is one thing Apple does right its marketing. They have convinced millions of people around the world that there one version of a smart phone is best for them and the masses follow suit. Rim on the other hand is busy coming out with a new phone every three months that is slightly different from the last twelve.

What are the chances there just screwing with us and come october 10th crackberry kevin gets to officially announce the "ahead of schedule" BB10 next generation dual core QNX based multi tasking powerhouse smart phone.

BB increased their user-base except US? That's not true in Indonesia

My BBM contact keep decreasing and more people start bringing two phones either with Android or iPhone. BB is only used for BBM here.

Because of this delay I'm preparing to jump off to WP8 when it's available unless RIM can tease us with more awesome BB10 features

For a fraction of the mounting losses, and for a fraction of the cash on hand, RIM could hire a second shift of software/hardware developers to bring OS 10 to fruition. How they can position such promising material, only to lose out on the holiday buying season? Not to mention the calendar 4Q is a common fiscal first quarter for many businesses (their core clientele).

I feel for their desire to make it perfect, but that does not mean you move the goal posts.

given the amount of cash RIM started with, and given the loyalty of their die hards, watching RIM go down is maybe equivalent to watching an elephant get shot every day for years before it finally lays down to die. sure they have cash, but the cash they have is now the failsafe instead of the reserve. the cash has went from something to brag about to something that is entirely necessary to keep the company afloat. those are very very very different scenarios for your "cash". when it becomes a necessity to survive it may as well be a line of credit, because i know, you know, the author of this knows, yeah it exists now, but will it exist like it does whenever bb10 is "ready" by q1 the device will be over a year late. you're talking about 2 iphone updates and 4 android updates during that timeframe. you're talking about watching android go from 25% marketshare to 60% marketshare, all the meanwhile the small market you've managed to retain is sitting around spinning in circles buying into your b.s. about playbook updates, which were a year delay, and "next platform" updates which has been the talk for years now also. how long to you expect even the die hard to stick around? i'm sorry but there indeed is NOT a big developer push for bb10. no doubt they will have some core major app support, but it will still launch with even microsoft having over 100,000 apps in their marketplace on a platform that has existed for only 2 years and has a smaller marketshare than RIM does. obviously times are troubled for RIM but the board isn't going to sit around and let the company burn through the cash reserves. they aren't microsoft, they aren't apple, they never have been never will be, and when the launch of bb10 can't be predicted to be more profitable than the cash they're burning through, the board will sell the companies assets for straight up cash. the idea they can dip into their cash isn't one that i buy very much. because all they can sell you is "trust us" but they've sold that already and nobody is really buying it anymore.

RIM, are you reading these comments? How about you fight for the people that has fought you for the last two years and get your act together. You are letting your BB family down.

I really hope this is a "it gets worse before it gets better" situation. The only way has to be up.

"The big question is, will BlackBerry 10 be good enough. THAT is what we need to spend our effort analyzing. I was happy to hear that Thorsten Heins won’t let the product launch before its ready."

remember folks, before you buy into the idea that bb10's delays are a quality assurance issue, let me remind you the man selling you this idealism is the same man in charge of bringing you the storm, storm 2, and the tour.

I was so hoping to ditch my iPhone and re-unite my PlayBook with a bridged BB10. This is a really sad day.

How can we expect RIM to even execute release of BB10 by 2013 when they are laying off people left and right. There is a certain point where one can reduce the workforce to improve efficiency without crippling productivity. In the rush to save cash I think RIM is at the point where it may be comprising productivity of its workforce. Things are going to start taking longer to accomplish as the employee base diminishes and people spend more time at work polishing their resumes. Moral can't be good at RIM and unfortunately, I think it will be reflected in the release of BB10, if it is ever released. The best we can hope for is that BB10 will be licensed under some other company. But having seen how that worked out for HP with WebOS viable companies for this type of play will be cautious.

Lets wait and see but nothing here is good.

After a long night of analysis I see little to be positive about here - it was a disaster of a day. The ONLY plus is that RIM did not go ahead and release a 1/2 baked product, that would have been worse.

I actually REALLY like my 9810 so I am sticking with RIM for now. It's a sad day but it's not the end of the world.

Here comes my 2 cents. I don't trust anyone when they say, "We'll launch when it's perfect". Jon Rubinstein from Palm, at the time he was the head of the webOS division of HP, months after they introduced the Touchpad, Veer, and Pre3 and before the discontinuation said this exact same thing. They launched the tablet and reviews of the tablet were a mixed bag. It didn't stand out, it had performance issues even with the latest dual-core CPU and 1GB of RAM that even the iPad didn't even have at the time. The Touchpad was NOT perfect in any way and was barely any improvement at all over webOS 2.x and the 3 updates they brought helped but it's still not perfect.

And look at the Playbook. Nothing said about that. I heard Thorsten was the head of the Playbook, Storm and Tour. The three biggest failures of RIM ever. So, the whole putting him as the head of the company, only time will tell what will happen. He might become the Leo Apotheker of RIM.

Fact - RIM cannot meet a deadline to save their lives not even their own deadline. Fact - They must have known for a while they wouldn't meet their initial launch date but they left everyone and I mean everyone) believing for months that the launch was going to be this year. When anyone dared speculate otherwise they were scorned.This is the worst aspect of this, not the actual delay - although that's bad enough.But it happens. Fact - there's no guarantee that the next deadline for BB10s will be met either. This is not down to media or press or people "having it in" for RIM. Excuses are easy but this is all of RIM's making.

...just how bad are things for RIM....

Bad enough that within the last few hours, there's been a large jump in the number of Playbook's that have suddenly gone on sale on Craigslist. Coincidence? Maybe. But if judging from the tone of the posts on Crackberry today; there is an awful lot of people who are simply fed up with RIM.

No matter of money - and it isn't alot in the grand scheme of things - will do a company any good if, by the time they actually get their heads out of their butt and release a "perfect" device (rolled my eyes when I heard that word), there's no one left around who actually gives a darn about your products.

I honestly feel that RIM had their one shot - bringing BB10 to market this year - consumers were willing to give Thorsten and the powers that be that much of a chance and wait. But as soon as the words "delayed until Q1, 2013" which, using RIM's understanding of time - think wibbily, wobbely, timey wimey way - could mean anything, all of that good will that Thorsten had was lost.

So how much damage was done to RIM? That's not really the question is it. The true question is, does anyone even care anymore that RIM exists? The answer to that wont be found on websites such as this one - the people here are the exception. It's the average consumer that RIM has to worry about. And I suspect, their answer is a resounding "is RIM even still around?"

Everyone loves to blow everything out of proportion. We knew this was going to be a hard year for RIM. They are starting from scratch again, this isnt an incremental update like iOS 6 or the next unhealthy food item android update. Think of RIM as a new company with the launch of BB10. The past no longer matters, most of the old guard has either quit or been let go. BB10 is a new beginning, so what if its delayed a couple months? It has to be perfect, it cannot be another Playbook launch. They have to get it right. Also launching at the same time is iphone5 would be a terrible idea. RIM would be fighting for the media spotlight. If they launch in the new year they would have no new competition to compete with. They would have the spotlight on themselves.

Thanks Chris. Great perspective.

New products or rather ideas take time. Unless you're interested in fighting the patent people or paying royalties.

Let's give RIM some room to work so we can enjoy the fruits of their labor.

As long as they have enough cash to get the product out the door - introducing a state of the art or trend setting product, or both takes time - let's stop focusing on the clock and continue to provide new ideas and desires for the designers and developers to focus their attention.

And for you RIM observers - well - get back to work.

Yoi know what? Just had a thought. The other day, I went to my local AT&T store just to check on a 9860 (I have a 9800 and love it)just to look it over because my contract is up in Feb '13 and was eager to get the BB10. Well, we know how that's going. Anyway, I ask about BB's and they only had 2 modals (they had at least 5 or 6 when I got my 9800). They could order the 9860 if I wanted. Anyway, with RIM seeming to be going out of business, I wonder how long it will be before the carriers just drop service to BBs. That happens and we'll know RIM is gone and they cAn continue to bs people all they want about "delays", etc... No carrier will service them.

I have 2 BBs a 9810 and a 9800, one is due by august the other by summer 2013. The questions is how many people are in this position, for me is a wait anyways cause I can't buy at full price any unit, I wait for the 2 year contract to expire to get my new units whatever is there to choose. I for me can wait because of my situation, I Would had been happy to get one BB10 this year but I have to wait til next summer for the second unit anyway, so I just get them when they get out and contract expires.

A while ago I thought all the bad news was over. Then RIM kicked me in the jewels. With all the knowledge in my head, I haven't started to feel the excruciating pain yet, but I know it's coming.


.......Yes! Im a hardcore bb fan... So what!!!!

It`s not waiting till Q1 2013 that is necessarily a problem (though it doesn`t help). It`s the freakin` big miss. All along it was they were on target for October 2012 and then all of a sudden, they`re out by likely 5-6 months. Seriously?

After the new CEO came in, it was supposed to be different. But it`s turning out to be the same old crap. When was the last time RIM hit their target dates? Look, if I were promising October 2012, then I`d be pretty damn sure I was actually looking to hit August 2012 and give myself a 2 month buffer. To miss by that much, again, is totally inept.

That`s not to say RIM won`t survive, or even succeed wildly. But whatever comes out now has to even that much more amazing.
I just don`t get it, they basically have BB10 devices, it`s a Playbook. It`s the developer device. How much work to cram in the radio, which you have been doing for YEARS?

Look, I`ll excuse them if the OS is more polished than the PB OS, will go toe-to-to in the app space with Android if not iOS, has 2x the battery life of anyone else and has a camera to match Nokia`s Pureview

hardcore enough to own stocks? if so that's a sorry predicament you find yourself in. especially when the rest of the world will start crucifying again because of this massive delay, RIM and their stocks will once again take a hit..

..."wait a little while and get a full baked device"...

how baked do you want it? the BB platform has been out for years and they refused to accept that change was necessary to compete in the smartphone race. for all your bravado praising BB7 it's still light years behind the top 2 mobile OS on the market today. now they are scrambling and failing to met any deadlines they set for themselves...if you run a business like this you would be out of the job in less than a year...

and yes i'm a BB user, and have been for a few years now but it's a shame there's less reason for me to bring it out of my pocket everyday....

one more thing, you seem quite happy with BBOS7...would you call that fully baked?

Always enjoy reading the comments on this and I thought I'd add my own.

Two issues arise: the problems inherent in the delay itself, and, possible management problems. As regards the former, the Galaxy S iii is already available, and iOS 6 is likely only to be an incremental update, so it doesn't matter so much if the phone is out after the iPhone as it matters that BB10 is a generational leap over the others: the world's first third generation mobility platform. If the BlackBerry 10 platform were only roughly equal to iOS6 it is hard to see whether releasing it at the same time as the iPhone 5 would be any better than releasing BB10 at all at any time. BB10 has to be a radical leap over iOS6 and the comparable Android in order that BB flourish, so it doesn't matter if it comes out a little later on. And BB will either flourish or die.

The corporation's financial limitations are also a bigger factor than whether old or more new users will adopt B10. The company will begin to burn cash after fiscal 2013 q2, I.e October 2012, and the company will deteriorate faster and faster from then on until it either bounces back with the BB10 release or disintegrates. The stock will deteriorate through 2012. If BB10 succeeds, anyone who buys the stock toward the end of 2012 will make an absolute killing. I bought stock at 11 and will buy more towards the end of 2012.

RIM is basically a new company. The only things that are the same from the past are its best existing strengths -- the NOC and the push email system from the 1990's that forms the backbone of the company to this day and that with the upcoming industrial grade platform will form the basis of the ultimate LTE mobility platform in the history of wireless computing.

Written on my 64GB PlayBook.

Sadly, BB 10 will not be a radical leap for 99% of phone users. Google has already acquired most of the good ideas from webOS, which was a radical advance on the iPhone at the start of 2011, and has acquired the core Enyo developers who made the magic happen on screen. Many of the ideas that have leaked about the BB 10 UI are already in Enyo, including the sliding panes.

I had hoped myself that BB 10 was in reality further advanced than had been revealed, and a launch date around September was planned. But 2013 means that it will come after the other makers have their flagship launches in the US in October. By January the general public will be spent out and corporates will already have finalised their plans for the next FY.

Dont really know what to say. Rim's outlook is bleak. Cant wait to see what the stock does when trading opens. Im thinking 7.50$. Its gonna be a bloodbath. BB7 is obviously not selling at all. I lost my phone last week and called rogers for one of its cheap replacement phones they'll give you mid contract if you misplace your phone without having to extend your contract and i was offered..... wait for it. 99$ for a 9900. I couldnt believe it. She said she could sell me more than one if i wanted another backup!!!! Yikes!

BB10 is beginning to sound more and more like the story of Big Foot... what is RIM going to do to keep persons interested in this great arrival. I'm disappointed to say the least, to see a company slowly begin to fall from the graces of so many. If BB10 makes it with the entire business still intact I'll be shocked to say the least.

I never post here but have hung in there with RIM all this time. All I can say is it time for me to move on, my Storm is already way behind everyone else's phone. And the last one to leave BlackBerry please turn out the

Thx @ Chris for his analysis.
This community consists of fans, users and some who work for the company. A friend of mine is working for the company and the sad story is, that he is going to be jobless in the weeks coming.
This guy is a fan, a user and an employee of the company without guidance.

All I can say is that I would love to see RIM make it over the rainbow but I think its time for the board members to say actually what way they are directing to and what is theier aim. They better sell the company to the canadian state or amazon who have enough cash flow and ressources to make BB10 happen in time. I am very sad and more disappointed than ever before.

the problem with RIM in the past few years is that they've taught faithful fans to lower their expectations for the products they ship...what's worse even with lowered expectations they continue to relentlessly find ways to shatter what's left of your pride in believing in them...and do they actually care?...if they would i would think they would be practically be giving away all those excess BB7 devices they have in stock...

they should sell out their souls (OS) and go with the flow....go droid...obviously their pioneering days are over and they do not have the drive or understanding on delivering what the market has evolved into.


Im out of contract, my curve is way past its best and Im needing an upgrade sooner rather than later.
I was hoping to jump on the new BB from day one but now I will have to question if I can wait that long. I dont want an andriod or iphone but I do need a phone so if RIM do what they seem to be good at and delay even longer my hand may well be forced :(

die hard fan or not if this doesn't shake your faith in ground breaking ways you need to be examined. it's odd how some people think this is just a "few months" delay at worse, because judging from RIM's recent track record it might not even be the last delay for BB10. kind of makes you think if this is all smoke and mirrors to delay the inevitable...

I would love to see a complete turn around for RIM's fortunes, and whether people want to admit it or not the market would benefit immensely from another strong contender to keep pushing innovation out to consumers. but this delay is just foul smelling as ever. it's bad enough that the BB10 launch was already initially delayed before, and now here we go with the same story again.

to some degree it's easy to say "we want to release a perfect device/OS" but sadly that will NEVER EXIST! because the next best thing will always be around the corner. to think that delaying the launch to make things better is a good thing is just ignorant of the fact that broken promises are never a good way to gain people's trust.

first it was the flopped playbook launch, then news that current BB7 devices were not going to upgradeable to BB10, a few months later rumors of playbook OS2 seemed like it just might save the playbook, but again numerous delays only fueled increased expectations...and by the time it was released it sounded like a collective "MEH!" from everyone waiting...and even then it WAS INCOMPLETE (read: no email protrait mode at DELAYED LAUNCH)...then RIM kicks into high gear promoting BB10 and internal restructuring, only to fall into the same ole tired loop of broken promises.

the only shinning light came when it was thought that BBM was going to finally make it mainstream into other devices, but RIM closed the door on that and evidently sealed any hopes of rising from all this crap they shove down the throats of their faithful followers. what makes it worse is that they still continue to ask for exorbitant prices for people buying into the RIM ecosystem and they have really nothing worth switching to anymore.

BBM is cool and possibly the best existing mobile communication application out there today ...that's all for nothing when all your friends are on Skype?

thanks for turning the rest of the world against BB users

Well, at least this frees me up to buy the iPhone this year. We'll see about BB 10 when it makes its debut. Who knows. I may return to the fold. Or maybe not.

RIM is finished. I am procuring smartphones for my customers in the Autumn and they will now all move to the (no doubt new) iPhone. The 9900 was disaster for business users and I have been hoping against hope that is was just a stop gap. It is obvious to me that all RIM now has to offer is BBM and you cant base the entire offering around a single feature no matter how good it is. To suggest that many developers are on board is ridiculous. Once there were three, now there are two.

I have said before that I really like OS7 and the 9930, so BB10 being delayed doesn't have the same impact on me as it does for those who want or need to upgrade soon. My major concern is the thought that BlackBerry, as we know it, could cease to existing. I understand the disappointment with and frustration toward RIM because I,too, believe that they are not telling the truth about why BB10 is being delayed. I just don't want these phones that I love so much to become just a memory. Very sad right now.

I love Blackberry but you are starting to fade away. Now with the delay of BB10 It is going to be hard. Something has got to give or I may be leaving also. I have had a blackberry since they were pager size. So do not tell me I don't love bb but the writing is on the wall. You better clean the walls or I will have to go also.

I expect now a new 9900 will be more reasonably priced and I will go out and get one. When I say reasonably priced, I mean $400 less than current retail. I am not slighting the awesome phone or RIM, just their $600-good-laptop price.

I've not been that much surprised by the delay; in BB10 jam, questionning about API's release schedule, I got nothing but a bunch of "ish" months, ending September 2012. Then, an October release sounded like a fantasy to my ears. I already pushed the date to December.

About figures, I believe you painted it right, still, there might be a struggle at every single unattended event (work force runaways, competitors exploits, general economy deterioration). The longest the wait, the biggest the risk. (pushing open doors here).

So, where is my grief ?

Same as yours. They still don't know how to communicate.
Morning session @ Paris was [self-censored].
Now the Q1 conference ... you detailed it.

Where are my hopes (chrono) ?
1. Playbook (with or without LTE) OS 2.1 release
2. A new device, running BB7 and BB10 upgradable. ASAP.
In the meantime, they must PROVE BB10 is REAL. Betas (dev Alpha ?) are now mandatory.

In short : They killed the momentum option.

There were two things I heard in the call yesterday that scared me. Chris addressed one in the podcast following the call, but not in the article, the other I didn't see addressed - though I think I heard a follow up question in the Q&A that followed the comments from Thorsten and the guys.

1. RIM is currently losing money on the hardware its selling now. This is going to give them tremendous trouble pricing new equipment - the new PlayBook and the new phones, and will continue to exacerbate the losing quarters going forward. Everyone is assuming Q1 is January and that's a 3 month delay, but Q1 for Playbook last time was mid Feb and end March would also work as Q1 - that's 6 months out from the October 2012 expectation. They will have missed the key back to school and Christmas/Hanukkah seasons as well - and in between it all the new iPhone will be out - and Jelly Bean will be rocking on the new Android devices by then (The GNex already has it). I agreed with Kevin that iPhone didn't matter if the BB10 was coming shortly thereafter - but 6 months later - not sure the picture is the same then.

2. Cap Ex. What I understood from the call is right now RIM is building up cash by selling down inventory and not replacing it. Leads me to believe that what we heard about the hardware being ready is not true, and it's not built yet either as they haven't spent the money they are taking in. (Better said they may know the hardware specs already - but they haven't started actually building out the new hardware yet - that's Cap Ex)

Building out the new lines is going to require a lot of money and once it starts the balance sheet should take a big hit. Then they have to spend the money marketing the new phones as well. Chris addressed this in previous articles, but the call really illustrated to me how little they are spending for forward positions and that makes the current cash position a straw man. There was a question about Capital expenditures from one of the analysts and from what I heard RIM didn't answer the question and skirted it. That concerns me.

randall2580, you're seeing exactly what I'm seeing!!

My conclusion is that RIM has never really intended to build the devices (BB10 phones, or playbooks). The "delays" in BB10 OS are purely to put off the building of hw until they find a buyer which is what the company has wanted to do for a few months now (probably since the middle of the Q4F12). BTW, I think selling the company is the best for current investors.

My guess is that they are getting close to finding a buyer.

You mean following the old, buy low sell high principle of investment?

By now many of RIM's investors will be losing money on some pretty major investments.

The company would not raise more than it's current capitalization - always assuming anyone would want to buy. I can't see why anyone would to be honest.

The investors best bet is to grit their teeth, hold on and wait and see.

Either way they're not going to lose any more than they already have.

Prem Watsa - one of the largest investors - said it would take 5 years to turn the company around. I'm not sure why anyone thinks otherwise. He does have a clue about this stuff.

Your point #1 makes sense and is a concern to me also.  Your point #2 is a misunderstanding on your part.  I will clarify for you.  CapEx = capital expenditures and represents cash spent on capital assets such as equipment, lease improvements, computer infrastructure, etc.  Usually for RIM the heavy capex investments they've done have been for the NOC.  Other heavy cash uses have been patent acquisitions.


RIM does not have to spend money building manufacturing lines.  They have contract manufacturing partners for this.


RIM's cash position is increasing, in part, due to inventory being sold faster than it is being replaced.  THIS IS NORMAL for a company going through a big transition on its product lines.  It is not a sustainable way to generate cash (inventory can only go down so much).  


With BB10 not being launched until Q1 it makes no sense for RIM to start building hardware at this point.  Instead, they will be forming supply agreements on key components and scheduling deliveries for closer to the date.  They'll make smaller batches 6 months out (i.e. starting soon) and slightly larger batches 3 months out.  The big push to manufacture lots of them won't happen until they are much closer to shipping. 



I have stayed loyal with RIM since my first smartphone 5 years ago, I have had a 8703, 9630, 9650, 9930[current phone], and I bought my daughter a playbook. I have also been somewhat emotionally invested in RIM/BB for some reason. I still believe it is the BEST communications device on the market.

I am also stuck with VZW. The 3G network is ailing badly! My hopes were that BB10 would be available on LTE somewhere in the next couple of months. That obviously isn't going to happen. If Apple comes out with a compelling iphone 5 with LTE, I will likely switch just so I can kick this 3G network to the curb.

After reading your June 1 article and this one, I am not sure if you know your way around a balance sheet, income statement, and cash flow statement. RIM has an Operating loss for the quarter. An Operating Loss means cash burn (remember that word from the Internet Bubble days?). There is no sugarcoating cash burn. To repeat, the market looks ahead and does not like what they see in RIM, especially the fact that RIM's ecosystem is limited to only smartphones and tablets fighting against companies with major ecosytems (AAPL, GOOG, MSFT). RIMM is not even in the smartphone conversation anymore.

Yeah, I wasn't sure either. Thanks for clarifying though. Correct me if I am wrong, I think they have increased their cash position due to moving out some old inventory? I don't like what I see either, everyone expected they were going to report net loss this quarter, it's just that no one expected it was going to be this bad. I wish them the best of luck.

@chak - Wow.  That's all I can say man.  Wow.  You seriously wrote the above with a straight face and believe it to be true? 


So, for the benefit of everyone else who may be confused by this:


1) Operating profit or loss is expressed on the income statement.  It is an accounting measure of profitability and does not take into consideration changes on the balance sheet.


2) Cash flow statements exist because income statements don't tell the whole story.  Lost on some people, obviously.   It is quite common for technology companies to have big D&A charges on the income statement, which, by definition, are non cash.  They get added back on the CF statement.  Income statement also doesn't capture capital expenditures or changes in working capital (inventory, A/R, A/P primarily).  This is why a comapny like RIM can still be cash flow positive despite losing money on an accounting basis.


But let's keep it our little secret :)

All the "gee whiz, RIMM will rise again" optimism is, unfortunately, not reality (BTW, I use the BB9900). By Q1, 2013, Samsung Galaxy III will be in full swing, Apple will be into the 2nd quarter of the new iPhone and who knows what the Google is up to. A "Chrome Phone" has to be around the corner.

Even if the BB10 was released today, and was awesome, I don't think there is enough time to swing it back. To get their new product to a point that good numbers are being generated, would take double digit months. One has to ask, does RIMM have that kind of time? So many employees paying the price is really sad and I hate that. Every one of them matter. Unfortunately, there is no founder of the company that can come back and reinvigorate what made RIMM what it was.

I believe it is now "sell, break up or die". Sad state of affairs, it really is. Unfortunately, this bleeding may not stop until after BB10 is released. I hope not, but prepare yourselves for an Amazon or FB reality.

RIM is busy cleaning up it's balance sheet. Another massive write off this quarter. That's three in a row.

Yes sales were down, but sales are generally lower this quarter.

And all that inventory revaluation they're going through should translate into sales when they start dropping devices at low cost.

RIM as with other manufactures is facing huge competitive pricing pressure from Samsung. It's a race to the bottom on price and only the strong will survive.

RIM's real problem is the way they've completely lost the plot with their brand image. They should have taken the company private when they had the chance.

Prices are so low I can't see that current major investors would have anything to lose. And they have everything to gain if a private company - freed from the necessity of these brand damaging quarterly reports - can turn around the company and perhaps go public again once they had done so.

And even if they didn't remain a major player they'd still be more likely to start generating a return as a private company.

OK, I think you're right with this analogy but his suggestion is very valid. I think if RIM wasn't so pressured by investors, the top brass might actually make some level-headed decisions. I don't think that they're necessarily going to be done for good, just no longer remaining a major player. The market is plenty big for RIM to fill its own niche. Going private may be a good decision for RIM.

You left out one critical detail Chris. Apple and Microsoft have other ways to make revenue to weather out the storm. RIM is only in the smartphone industry. They don't make PC's laptops or office suites. Every bad quarter greatly affects sales. They are completely done. There is zero confidence in them as a company. They are laughing stocks of the tech industry. The wake up campaign looks completely silly. Jokes on them.

BB fanboy will be cry cry cry and RIM will die die die... thanks rim for giving apple 'wake up' stunt, the thing that sadly you'll never be.

IMHO Thorsten Heins has to go, they need a fresh leader in there that knows how to execute. I was impressed when he was brought on, but he is just issuing more RIM death nails.

Bring in someone from the competition really shake things up. By the time BB10 comes out Droid and iOS will steal the show by taking all the good features.

RIM needs to get more agile, this BB10 not until 2013 news is just devastating to me as a BB user. I feel very short changed by RIM. May start looking at shitty droid phones now.

Dear Alec, Thorsten and RIM board,

A week ago I would have been writing to you to insist that the boot-up time for BB10 on the Dev Alpha device (as on the playbook) must be addressed. Imagine the first un-boxing video on Engadget, then understand how that sets the tone.
I would also have pleaded that RIM make BB10 and the hardware distinguish itself from the competition by offering stellar battery performance. 48hrs when others barely make 24hrs (the thinness quest is bogus, give us an extra 1000mAh any day).
And finally, please OH please get another mapping supplier!

BUT since last night none of that matters. And I'm genuinely sad to say that.

How is it possible that BB10 has gotten postponed once again?
Who in their right mind at RIM actually believes that existing customers will sit around waiting for BB10 when all the other eco-systems are constantly evolving and gaining market share?(compounding the isue, the iPhone5 will be out by then and the Samsung S3 will probably still best it)
And with so many people fired who is left to ensure that BB10 delivers?

We're a development team and we've recognised the robustness of BBs many years ago, but the last 2-3 years the maintenance of the old OSs has been so poor it's financially penalised us for continuing to service and support RIM devices. The deterioation in battery too has been eye-opening. And the whole idea that RIM believed marketing the fastest Blackberry...the best Blackberry browser experience ever was justified, was to fail to understand why Apple could get away with the same claims of the best iPhone ever. BECAUSE the user experience had set the industry standard (btw developing is no picnic on iOS, they can't handle multi-tasking and battery life sucks, but then again it's all to ensure the UX is good - I use a BB and an S3).

So, how could you and RIM have told us developers for the last few months how close things were, to have gotten us this excited (flow, camera, multi-tasking, cascades, keyboard) and then to wait for a Qrtly earnings call to to bitterly disappoint the only community that will in the end make BB10 a success, the developers?

If RIM, and this is at you Alec, had recognised the market opportunity that is building a parallel Android store where every app submitted would have gotten a proper security and code check for quality, then you could have owned Android for the enterprise market (because BYOD is for real and much more diverse than just iPhones!). In short building on RIMs reputation for security and understanding the needs of enterprise. After all Amazon have shown you can fork the code and set up an entire retail Android eco-system. While Cisco failed with their Android enterprise offering and were massively out of their comfort zone, they did spot the market opening.

The Android market is it's own worst enemy (calling it a cesspool though sounded like envy), but it is also littered with great developers and even better apps. Yes it's a fractured OS with many screen formats to deal with, but hell so is BB and the RIM developer tools were until very recently a disaster to work with. Most important though was the missed opportunity to own a niche in Android that no one has conquered yet - enterprise.

Asking developers to wait till next year to monetise their efforts to make BB10 competitive is just too much. It's such a huge shame as QNXs ability to first run Android (although you limited access to all the hardware) and more recently an iOS port is testament to the robustness of QNX.

Pride and prejudice is looking like it will cost RIM dear. Most likely everything. Such a shame.
Sincerely sad
Frank George

Good isn't good enough. It's time for greatness....Correction, it was.

PS. When Microsoft revealed Windows Phone 8, and Nokia confessed their new, barely 3-4mth old flagship Lumia 900 wasn't going to be able to run WP8 when it finally launched, I actually thought, great finally some good news and a break for RIM to slip in there and steal Nokia's thunder. Become relevant again.

Postponing BB10 is suck a f-up!

Good isn't good enough. It's time for greatness.

It seems that only Devine intervention will save the day.

Nonetheless, I have a small suggestion. Playbook purchaser's, like me, are more likely to begrudgingly wait for 2013. That said, why not package the unsold playbook with the OS 7 handsets that apparently aren't selling as expected, to capture more 'captive' soles and at the same time generate some cashflow. This assumes that this can be done without cannibalizing current demand.

RIM is over and done with...stick a fork/knife...its over RIP

Apple and Android will rule the day....its there fault everyone else can produce phones on time...except RIM.

Fire sale time.

Mods.. please ban this dipsh_t and block his IP address. He is nothing but a douchey troll that has nothing better to do than stir the pot. BAN THIS LOSER!!!

RIM needs more rope to climb out of the deeper hole it continues to dig into.....

Question, is what will RIM look like by Q1 2013???